Climbing Tips for the Non-Climber

Magnus Bäckstedt, 195cm, 90kg
Non-Climber Magnus Bäckstedt, 195cm, 90kg

I’m a non-climber who enjoys climbing. I’d enjoy it more if I was good at it. And “enjoy” might be too strong a word, “tolerate” might be better. But dragging 89 kilos up a volcano gives one time to contemplate the cycling life .

Let us define non-climber. It’s someone either too fat, too big (gravitationally challenged) or a fast- twitching sprinter. Not liking to suffer does not make you a non-climber. As the moto camera drifts down the peloton on the Ventoux, it’s still the guys at the back who are dying the worst. Finishing within the time limit for the non-climber requires a trip deep into the cave-o-pain.

For the cyclist, the power-to-weight ratio (watts generated/body weight in kg) is king, especially when the road goes up. A large improvement in the power side of the formula is tough, we have already chosen our damn parents and cursed inheriting their vestigial hearts and lungs. Yes, this number should be honed to its finest edge, it can be nudged up but not a lot.

The weight side of the equation is completely changeable and under our control.

Lose some weight, you fat bastards. Yes, I’m talking to you. The most important thing to improve climbing, by far, is to lose some weight. Do you need dramatic proof? Put a known weight (2 liter bottles of water) into a knapsack and do a regular route. The hills will be bad, very bad. Now imagine losing that same two or four kilos. The difference can be just as impressive. When I’m at a decent riding weight, climbing out of the saddle for extended periods is not a problem. I’m still slow but gravity is not demanding I put my ass on the saddle. Losing body weight is free; one looks better on and off the bike. Your friends will hate you. What is the down side? Oh right, it takes self-control and not drinking as much alcohol as life requires.

Don’t carry extra weight on the bike. If you really don’t need a second large bidon, don’t carry that 0.8kg. That’s more than the difference between super-light climbing wheels and regular road wheels. For reasons I’ll never understand, a bike that is one kilo lighter seems noticeably faster than the one kilo saved from a bidon. So yes, N+1 can be invoked but it’s much cheaper to just leave that second bottle at home.

LeMan said the key to climbing was to relax…easy for him to say when he had the heart and lungs of three Velominati. But Rule #10 is Rule #10 so meditate on relaxing while dancing uphill. Find a little rhythm. Click up into a longer gear, pop out of the saddle, shift back down, park it back in the saddle.

Find a gear you can turn over comfortably. As we all know, Dr Ferrari was the one to get Lance to spin up climbs. It’s tough to know where the EPO stopped and the spinning started but it did seem to work for him. While some may argue for climbing in the big chainring, for us non-climbers, climbing in the saddle and spinning a gear will get us up faster and with less collateral damage.

The best part of climbing as a non-climber is that we are out there, doing it. The Stelvio, hell yeah, it’s going to take a little longer to get up there but we will do it. We don’t stop, we don’t put a foot down. We suffer like you-know-who on you-know-what but we still do it with a stupid smiles on our faces.

 

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189 Replies to “Climbing Tips for the Non-Climber”

  1. @frank

    Maggie’s wearing Bonts. Good man. That is a great photo.

    Exactly, once I switch over to Bonts, I will become more Maggie-like. And if he likes them, I will.

  2. @Al__S

    @Gianni

    @Al__S

    Great advice, though the “lose weight” is maybe a little late for the trip I’ve just booked with a mate to Tenerife in April. Having only taken up cycling after moving to Cambridgeshire, a 2200m 6% climb is somewhat daunting. But enticing, nonetheless, which means I must have properly caught cycling madness.

    6% is very do-able no matter how long it goes. Haleakala averages around that at 3300m, it all depends how fast you go at it. Even I can do it at slog speed.

    It won’t beat me. I won’t let it. There’s another 1500m to the actual summit of Teide, but that appears to be mountain bike country.

    @chris it isn’t quite as bad as resorting to car parks. There’s, um, Madingley rise. And Chapel Hill. And heading south into Hertfordshire and Essex gives quick access to lots of little but sharp climbs.

    Wheathampstead is a nice 1 in 8, which I used to commute every day.

  3. @VeloSix sounds like a similar theory to a bloke who knew a thing or two about going uphill fast

    “Marco, why are you such a strong climber?”

    “To shorten my pain”

  4. @Mikael Liddy

    @Ccos

    @wiscot Well, Keith Richards cites his avoidance of cheese as the key to his longevity (re: failure to die).

    Maybe they’re on to something here.

    If you’re taking health advice from Keith Richards I’m pretty sure cheese (or lack thereof) will be the least of your issues…

    I’m just saying, the dude is hard to kill and he attributes this to not eating cheese. Imagine him as a cyclist had he not gone down the music pathway.

    He probably would still be doped to the gills just the same.

  5. I like the mantra when riding I use two.

    “you’re probably not riding hard enough”

    and courtesy @frank and Johan Museeuw

    “why would you want to slow down?”

  6. @The Oracle

    I’m positive I posted something meaningless in this thread last night, but I can’t find it now.

    Anyway, my weight has been on a yo-yo this winter, anywhere from 74 to 78kg. I’m looking for suggestions on how to trim that down to a consistent 72 without sacrificing frozen pizza’s or IPA’s. Maybe, only eat every other day?

    Close to my heart this one !   Same issue.

  7. @Gianni

    You live in Tassi? It must me a great cycling place, it keeps turning out great cyclists.

    No. I live in North Queensland. Just that Tas is my favourite place/state in Aus. Speaking of Rule #5, I’d live there in a heart beat if I could get work there….. and it wasn’t so freaking cold. As a skinny cyclists from the tropics… I struggle with it. At least it doesn’t stop me visiting.

  8. @ChrisO

    It’s about power and weight, not how many cols you’ve bagged. I don’t think you actually need to do a lot of climbing to be a good climber.

    Riding at 350W is riding at 350W whether you’re on the flat or on a climb. In fact I find it easier (mentally at least) to do 350W up a hill and I know people who claim they actually produce higher numbers on climbs over flats for the same effort.

    I’ve been triaining for nearly three months for the Scody 3 Peaks Challenge.  That’s 235km and something like 4000m of climbing, for me, in under 10hrs. Now here is the thing; have I been doing hill repearts? Nope.  My Coach has had me doing shit loads of high power endurance efforts aimed at increasing my FTP.

    My thoughts are if cadence is the same, and pedal torque is the same ( and so power is the same), it makes no difference whether the road is flat, 5% or 20%. All that varies is the speed as a function of the first two. I think folks can hold higher power numbers up hill because they are forced to do so. To take it to the other side of things, riding down hill at high power is difficult. Its too easy to let things slip a little on the flats. Up hill, dropping cadence or pedal torque slightly is obvious. No so much on the flats.

  9. @johnthughes

    @Dfitz

    Great advice, thanks! I’ll remember those sagely words as I drag my 95kg carcass up the granfondo Stelvio in June!!

    Doing it myself at the end of June, but not the fondo, just my club taking over a hotel in the Bormio, spending a week riding the climbs, and finishing everything out with the Stelvio on the last day. I am looking forward to it with both anticipation and complete horror. I wouldn’t mind hearing what others have to say about rides up it.

    My advice, don’t leave The Stelvio until the last day. You will want to do it more than once for sure. It’s so spectacular, up a valley, tunnels, switchbacks. I remember watching the pros go up there in a recent Giro and they had to take a wide line on the corners because of the speed they were carrying. I’ve racked my brain but can’t remember having the same problem. On the way back down we saw some Katusha boys going up, going fast and casually chatting!

  10. @Ccos

    @Frank

    @Puffy Can’t revise the rules as they have come down from on high. Imagine the revised Ten Commandments: “Thou shall not kill, unless he has it coming.”

    Revision opens the door to trouble.

    What? No no no no. “Revise – reread work done previously to improve one’s knowledge of a subject”. Go remind yourself of the rule, not change it! Shit, i’m the right amount of dumb, not insane enough to suggest Rule #10 needs revision.

  11. @Puffy

    @Ccos

    @Frank

    @Puffy Can’t revise the rules as they have come down from on high. Imagine the revised Ten Commandments: “Thou shall not kill, unless he has it coming.”

    Revision opens the door to trouble.

    What? No no no no. “Revise – reread work done previously to improve one’s knowledge of a subject”. Go remind yourself of the rule, not change it! Shit, i’m the right amount of dumb, not insane enough to suggest Rule #10 needs revision.

    Revision and iteration is for software and philosophy, not religion. The Rules will not be changed.

  12. No one has mentioned Krabbe yet. As usual he has some excellent suggestions:

    let your mind become a small, featureless black ball.

    Battawoogreek-greek.

  13. @Chris

    @The Pressure On the plain! And where’s that soggy plain? North of Huntingdon, near the edge of the fens. There aren’t many hurricanes here either but given the recent weather, I surprised that we’ve not become a seaside village overnight.

    I can ride 113 km to my parents place with only 350m of elevation. And that’s all at either end.

    Ah the soggy plain.  Tell me, is Friar Tuck a good climber??

  14. @norm

    @Chris

    @The Pressure On the plain! And where’s that soggy plain? North of Huntingdon, near the edge of the fens. There aren’t many hurricanes here either but given the recent weather, I surprised that we’ve not become a seaside village overnight.

    I can ride 113 km to my parents place with only 350m of elevation. And that’s all at either end.

    God that’s flat. I get 350m^ on my 15km to work and there isn’t anything that you’d even consider a real ‘hill’.

    Are you riding Ashdown on Sunday?

    That’s not flat.  Not far from where I live in south Louisiana, I rode a century (160 km) with a total elevation change of <35 meters.  That’s flat.  I had to do an hour and a half of hill repeats to get 1,000 meters of climbing, and that’s in what’s considered hilly country around here.

  15. “I had to do an hour and a half of hill repeats to get 1,000 meters of climbing, and that’s in what’s considered hilly country around here.”

    Shoot, I wish I could edit posts here…the above refers to a different ride entirely than that century.

  16. @piwakawaka

    I like the mantra when riding I use two.

    “you’re probably not riding hard enough”

    and courtesy @frank and Johan Museeuw

    “why would you want to slow down?”

    For me it’s “Catch that carnt” and “Hold that wheel, hold that wheel, hold that wheel..” repeated to take mind off breathing and pain…

  17. 1 mètre 59, 52 kilos, est-ce que cela fait de moi un bon grimpeur?

    je n’ai pas vraiment eu cette sensation lors de ma dernière montée de “La Madeleine” au milieu d’une boucle de 130 bornes!

  18. @ltraq Tout le monde souffre. Certains sont simplement plus rapide.

    At 1.88m and 67-68kg, I know it’s not really my weight holding me back, just as-yet insufficient heart-lung training.  But I’m always a little surprised that despite feeling like I’m dying on hills and  that butterflies must surely be able to rest happily on my spokes, I do ok compared to others who ride around here.

  19. Here is a saying I heard again the other day that has helped me get over alpine passes:

    “if you are going through hell, keep going”

  20. @andrew Indeed!

    I am never pleased of my climbing speed because of my lack of climbing technics,  but that  Rule #5 hammering in my head always makes me fast enough to enjoy that LEFFE and a blueberry pie at the top of a HC… and then, work my tucking technic on the other side!

  21. @ChrisO

    @Fausto

    @ChrisO

    5W/kg is fine, it just depends how long you’re expected to keep it there for!

    Obviously.

    But the suggestion was to hold it while other people are attacking so as not to be far behind, which means sustaining it for some time on a climb of a decent length.

    5W/kg for even 5 minutes is very good Cat 2 territory and 10 minutes would be Cat 1.

    It’s just meaningless advice – someone who can do 5W/kg isn’t getting dropped in the first place unless they are competing at a pretty high level.

    It’s like telling someone the way to run faster is to buy a stopwatch and do a sub 3 hour marathon.

    Should I be happy that I’m putting out 5W/kg+ for 5 mins as a 3rd Cat then? Roll on the hilly races this year! (I still think I’m going to get my arse handed to me, but that’s just me being pessimistic until proven otherwise)

    I know it’s meaningless, it was meant more as a dig at the original comments lack of qualification for power vs time. Faustina can put out 5W/kg , but it doesn’t last long and she normally needs extensive cake therapy to recover.

  22. The most important attribute for climbing well up significant mountains like the Stelvio, assuming you’re in reasonable physical shape, is MENTAL STRENGTH. You’ve got to accept that you’ll be going up an 8% gradient (+/- a few percent) with no respite for two to three hours. That’s a long time! So, you’ve got to settle in for the duration, enjoy the constantly changing views as you slowly progress up the mountain, and relax as much as possible. One of the most common problems people have is developing knee pain from pushing too high a gear. I used my lowest gear (34×30) for much of the Stelvio ascent during the Raid Dolomites last summer and I’m not a bad climber (173cm, 63 kg).

  23. @Chris

    @norm I never quite got round to signing up for Ashdown this year. My brother-in-law, who I usually do it with couldn’t make it and it’s a bit of a trek from my place.

    Ah cool, I won’t look out for you then. I’m looking forward to it but Its likely to be a slow crawl for me.

  24. @frank

     

    I don’t think Leinenkugel counts as beer?

    You are absolutely correct, and I never said that it did.If that is what you think our beer is, then my Wisconsin Velominati brethren and I have much to teach you.

    What would be the beer equivalent to the Pedalwan?

     

  25. @Fausto

    Should I be happy that I’m putting out 5W/kg+ for 5 mins as a 3rd Cat then? Roll on the hilly races this year! (I still think I’m going to get my arse handed to me, but that’s just me being pessimistic until proven otherwise)

    I know it’s meaningless, it was meant more as a dig at the original comments lack of qualification for power vs time. Faustina can put out 5W/kg , but it doesn’t last long and she normally needs extensive cake therapy to recover.

    Yes I think you should be. Of course it also depends what you’re doing – 5W/kg on the flat is less effective if you weigh 60kg, but devastating going uphill.

    In our race today we had a short sharp hill we went over three times  – and I was doing about 5.3W/kg up it for 2 minutes. That’s put me eighth overall on Strava for that segment (one second ahead of Oscar Pujol, a pro rider) and more importantly I was in the first two or three over the hill each time in the leading break.

    Don’t forget values of 6W/kg are regarded as Tour de France level – admittedly that’s at threshold but 5W/kg is pretty good even for 5 minutes (probably best to avoid the cake therapy afterwards though). It’s not just my opinion – if you look at the power profiles of Andrew Coggan (Training Peaks) it’s well up there.

  26. @TommyTubolare

    @KW

    “I wish I had become serious about riding 10 years ago. I’m saddened to think of all the miles I missed out on. I guess I’ll just have to catch up.”

    The quote above looks familiar? Don’t do the same stupid mistake twice. But I can tell you just by ditching cheese you could enjoy a glass of a good beer every evening and you’ll be fine. Either that or you can continue your bad habits to be a good guy from Wisconsin. The choice is yours.

    I didn’t own a bike 10 years ago. It’s hard to be serious about something you don’t participate in.

    I’ve never been one to subscribe to the “You can’t eat this or that” school of thought. All things in moderation, my friend.

  27. Composure is my tip for fellow non-climbers. When I climb ok, or less badly than normal, its because I’ve managed to stay focused and mantain a certain amount of composure and form. This doesn’t mean going easy but you have to stay in control.

    The worst thing you can do is panic, forget how to breathe and start flailing around on the bike.  

    Also if you are climbing slowly but are doing so in a casually deliberate style you can always make out that was your intention and you’re just training properly…

  28. @norm It’s going to be a bit different from last year when the temperature hovered around zero for the whole ride and the snow was being blown horizontally on the higher ground. Probably more reminiscent of the the London Cogal.

    Have a good one.

  29. It’s easy to see Magnus has some Bonts on his feet. Can anyone identify his helmet? Is that one of the top-end Uvex helmets that Shimano and Kittel and Degenkolb are wearing this year? Looks pretty slick. (by which for helmets means, not terrible)

  30. @norm

    Composure is my tip for fellow non-climbers. When I climb ok, or less badly than normal, its because I’ve managed to stay focused and mantain a certain amount of composure and form. This doesn’t mean going easy but you have to stay in control.

    The worst thing you can do is panic, forget how to breathe and start flailing around on the bike.

    This.

  31. @Chris

    @norm It’s going to be a bit different from last year when the temperature hovered around zero for the whole ride and the snow was being blown horizontally on the higher ground. Probably more reminiscent of the the London Cogal.

    Have a good one.

    Can’t identify his helmet but can tell you he’s riding a hand-built WyndyMylla Massive Attack 62cm frameset which is currently for sale at their workshop in Surrey.

  32. and that was clearly a reply from me to the wrong post.

    @Ron – see my f’d up post above regarding Maggie’s helmet

  33. @KW

    @TommyTubolare

    @KW

    “I wish I had become serious about riding 10 years ago. I’m saddened to think of all the miles I missed out on. I guess I’ll just have to catch up.”

    The quote above looks familiar? Don’t do the same stupid mistake twice. But I can tell you just by ditching cheese you could enjoy a glass of a good beer every evening and you’ll be fine. Either that or you can continue your bad habits to be a good guy from Wisconsin. The choice is yours.

    I didn’t own a bike 10 years ago. It’s hard to be serious about something you don’t participate in.

    I’ve never been one to subscribe to the “You can’t eat this or that” school of thought. All things in moderation, my friend.

    Trans-fats in moderation? Added sugar in moderation? Heroin in moderation?

    No thanks.  All three will fuck your shit up, even if you’ll get arguments from some quarters.

  34. Observations on today’s hills: Pushing a descent while you still feel like throwing up from the uphill you just finished is kind of exhilarating. Then misjudging a downhill hairpin bend in the wet, sliding on the muddy, leafy shoulder and ending up wedged against the barrier is significantly deflating.  The bike’s ok, though!

  35. @Nate

    @Marcus I fail to see what a triathlete who is not you and is wearing Bonts has to do with this article.

    I think he is taunting me because I like Magnus and Magnus is a triathlete. That is how Marcus shows love.

  36. @andrew

    @KW

    @TommyTubolare

    @KW

    “I wish I had become serious about riding 10 years ago. I’m saddened to think of all the miles I missed out on. I guess I’ll just have to catch up.”

    The quote above looks familiar? Don’t do the same stupid mistake twice. But I can tell you just by ditching cheese you could enjoy a glass of a good beer every evening and you’ll be fine. Either that or you can continue your bad habits to be a good guy from Wisconsin. The choice is yours.

    I didn’t own a bike 10 years ago. It’s hard to be serious about something you don’t participate in.

    I’ve never been one to subscribe to the “You can’t eat this or that” school of thought. All things in moderation, my friend.

    Trans-fats in moderation? Added sugar in moderation? Heroin in moderation?

    No thanks. All three will fuck your shit up, even if you’ll get arguments from some quarters.

    Do you make everything you eat from scratch? I hope you haven’t eaten any processed food lately, or eaten in a restaurant,  because I guarantee you’ve had trans fat and added sugar.

    I’m not naive enough to think that it’s reasonable for me (I can only speak for myself) to completely eliminate ALL bad things from my diet. My goal is to limit them as much as I can.

    And when did I mention anything about drugs? My comments were about food and drink.

  37. @Gianni

    @Nate

    @Marcus I fail to see what a triathlete who is not you and is wearing Bonts has to do with this article.

    I think he is taunting me because I like Magnus and Magnus is a triathlete. That is how Marcus shows love.

    Magnus is a triathlete now?  Unwelcome development, this is.

  38. @Mike_P

    @Chris

    @norm It’s going to be a bit different from last year when the temperature hovered around zero for the whole ride and the snow was being blown horizontally on the higher ground. Probably more reminiscent of the the London Cogal.

    Have a good one.

    Can’t identify his helmet but can tell you he’s riding a hand-built WyndyMylla Massive Attack 62cm frameset which is currently for sale at their workshop in Surrey.

    Hard to miss those, Mike! I know they are going for something new, but ouch, that font they use just isn’t workin’ for me.

  39. @McTyke

    The most important attribute for climbing well up significant mountains like the Stelvio, assuming you’re in reasonable physical shape, is MENTAL STRENGTH. You’ve got to accept that you’ll be going up an 8% gradient (+/- a few percent) with no respite for two to three hours. That’s a long time! So, you’ve got to settle in for the duration, enjoy the constantly changing views as you slowly progress up the mountain, and relax as much as possible. One of the most common problems people have is developing knee pain from pushing too high a gear. I used my lowest gear (34×30) for much of the Stelvio ascent during the Raid Dolomites last summer and I’m not a bad climber (173cm, 63 kg).

    Hell yes! If you are used to going fast, or going fast is one thing you love about cycling, long, steady gradients are definitely hell on Earth.

    I have commented that if I ever run afoul of the law (or get caught, I should say) the worst punishment a judge could hand out is not to impound all my bikes or put me in jail or community service. It would be to make me ride around on my bikes at something like 5kmph.

    I think this is why I don’t fancy long loaded touring – I don’t think I could handle slow climbs with four panniers. That said, I have done some light touring and absolutely dug it, so who knows…

  40. @KW

    @andrew

    @KW

    @TommyTubolare

    @KW

    “I wish I had become serious about riding 10 years ago. I’m saddened to think of all the miles I missed out on. I guess I’ll just have to catch up.”

    The quote above looks familiar? Don’t do the same stupid mistake twice. But I can tell you just by ditching cheese you could enjoy a glass of a good beer every evening and you’ll be fine. Either that or you can continue your bad habits to be a good guy from Wisconsin. The choice is yours.

    I didn’t own a bike 10 years ago. It’s hard to be serious about something you don’t participate in.

    I’ve never been one to subscribe to the “You can’t eat this or that” school of thought. All things in moderation, my friend.

    Trans-fats in moderation? Added sugar in moderation? Heroin in moderation?

    No thanks. All three will fuck your shit up, even if you’ll get arguments from some quarters.

    Do you make everything you eat from scratch? I hope you haven’t eaten any processed food lately, or eaten in a restaurant, because I guarantee you’ve had trans fat and added sugar.

    Essentially, yes, though I don’t mill my own grain.  Minimal processed food (and when then traditional, organic processes), no food with added sugar (or HFCS etc) as an added ingredient; trans fats are easy to avoid (living in Europe helps), even in restaurants if you’re selective, and though they do like to add sugar to things, a little communication goes a long way.

    I’d challenge anyone here to go 21 days without eating anything that lists any kind of sugar as an added ingredient, as well as avoiding alcohol.  Buy raw food and switch any cow-dairy to goat or sheep milk (and cheese if you must).  Changed my life, and I believe added sugar will be up there with cigarettes and trans-fats in 5-10 years.

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