The Bikes
The Bike. It is the central tool in pursuit of our craft. A Velominatus meticulously maintains their bicycles and adorns them with the essential, yet minimal, accoutrement. The Rules specify the principles of good taste in configuration and setup of our machines, but within those principles lies almost infinite room for personal taste.
It seems in some ways like a kind of Stockholm Syndrome, the way we honor our machines. We love them to a point that lies well beyond obsession. Upon these machines upon we endure endless suffering, but also find an unending pleasure. The rhythm, the harmony between rider and machine, the outdoors, the wind in our faces and air in our lungs.
The Bikes is devoted entirely to our machines. Ours, The Keepers, and yours, the Community. It features articles devoted to our bikes, and proves a forum for uploading photos of your own machines for discussion. We will be harsh, but fair; this is a place to enforce and enhance our observation of The Rules.
If you’d like to submit an article about your own beloved bike, please feel free to send it to us and we’ll do our best to work with you to include it.
- Rule #12 and the Cascade Effect
That is a very reasonable opening salvo for the Rule about bike ownership. Three is good and certainly a minimum, and we are talking road bikes here, if there was any doubt. They naturally become ordered: the #1 is ichi-ban, top dog, go-to bike for every and all rides. #2 was the old #1, ... - Guest Article: Black Is Not The New Black@kogalover is singing my song here. Bikes are beautiful. ’nuff said. VLVV, Gianni With all those posts on riding in winter and being visible, either by putting Eyes of Sauron or other car melting devices on one’s steed, or by even considering a YJA instead of donning plain black kit, it was about time to finally get ...
- Dialing in the StableThis was going to be an article about Rule #45. It is amazing how much time is wasted and matches burned when professionals stop for that second bike change to get back on their #1. With all the jigs available to team mechanics it would seem they could set up five bikes exactly the same. And ...
- Matching the drapes to the rugAs a longtime titanium bike owner, I’ve always been jealous of a beautiful painted frame but Ti and carbon frames don’t need paint like a steel frame needs paint. But I want some painted beauty. It’s like buying a white car; I can’t do white, need some color. So between a Ti frame and a ...
- Festum Prophetae: Waiting for the HourEveryone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth. – Mike Tyson The one thing everyone should always plan for is that however well-conceived a program might be, things will never go to plan. The high level plan for my Festum Prophetae Hour Ride was as follows: Have a custom Hour Bike built by Don Walker. Because reasons. Reasons like custom ...
@Dan_R
@Gianni Well, I considered various frame options. Full custom Sarto was a little pricey and the ultra lightweight frame makes some aesthetic sacrifices to my taste. I have therefore sacrificed saving weight in some areas, largely because skipping a few malted recovery beverages here and there will more than make up for the couple of hundred extra grams penalty for internal cable routing on this:
[dmalbum: path=”/velominati.com/wp-content/uploads/readers/Mark1/2013.03.18.23.53.23/1/”/]
@frank
Lookin’ nice! Love the orange bar tape, looks sharp with the white paint.
That being said, I’ll echo what @Chris said, it’s not a brand you see often. Scaler’s Blue is the only one I know of amongst everyone I know who rides, personally
OK chaps, I have a fit-related question:
I’m getting ready to replace all the cables on my bike, and thought it would be an ideal time to monkey with my bar setup.
I want to lower my stem one more spacer down. I currently have two spacers under the stem.
However, I don’t want my drops to go down any further than they currently are. I’ve always been curious about compact, classic bend bars. Would getting a set of handebars with less distance between the tops and drops be an OK solution to this?
Ideally I’d like to be a tad lower while riding on the tops, but keep about the same distance I have to go down to get to the drops.
For reference, this is my bike’s current setup, with arrows added for emphasis. Right now the distance from the middle of the top to the middle of the bottom at the back of the bar by the plug is about six inches.
Also, Here’s a link to a larger image if you want to zoom in or whatever
@mcsqueak
Are you on Terwilliger you bastard? I miss that road so much.
@PeakInTwoYears
Yes! I get up there all the time, then go up westwood to council crest. I’m not a fast climber, but doing that route certainly helps!
@mcsqueak That probably would work. Bars are typically measured for reach (how far forward from the flats to the apex of the bend), drop (how far from flats to drops) and width (how far apart the hands are). Usually but not always measured center-to-center, and in metric. So you could look for bars with same width, similar reach, and less drop, and set them up with less spacers. Most mfgrs publish these dimensions. This would lower the tops, and keep the drops in the same place.
@mcsqueak
I coulda swore that you already had your mind made up about that on Sunday. But I’ll agree with @Nate on this.
Before you go buy a set, I’ve got a pair that “may” fit the bill. Or may not. If they’ll work, you can have them for a beer or 2. You know how to get ahold of me.
@frank
Said it a few days ago, and I’ll say it again (publicly): that’s a bitchin’ set up!
@mcsqueak
The view was unmistakeable, and the last time the VMH were down for a visit we rode over the Hawthorne from Sellwood, up Terwilliger, up Westwood to Council Crest, on to the Sylvan exit on 26 and up 60-somthingst and down through the Arboretum and Washington Park and home. It was a tremendous nostalgia hit.
/wipes tear/
Next day we rode down to the Canby Ferry but the Canby Ferry was closed. And it was still so awesome to be riding out of Portland for the day. Same trip, I rode up to Corbett from a nice little cafe on 8th and N. Dekum. I like it up here on the Oly Pen in several ways (lots of wild animals and shit) but there is no, repeat no, substitute for a bike ride in and around Portland on a sunny day. Stimpy says, “Happy happy joy joy.”
@scaler911
Yeah but I’m indecisive and wanted input from the hoard regarding my idea.
@PeakInTwoYears
Nice! Yeah I’ve wanted to do a ride down to the Canby ferry and back around through east Portland for awhile, looks like such an awesome route on maps. When were you down here last?
@mcsqueak
A few weeks ago. Still got my folks in town and a bunch of old climbing friends. My kids are moved off to Northern CA and Bend. I’ll make noise next time we’re headed down, and maybe we do a ride?
@mcsqueak
Take up @scaler on his offer. If they work, you’re golden, Budgetatus style. If they don’t you’ll learn more about what works for you, by way of what doesn’t. Then, report back.
@PeakInTwoYears For sure, let me know.
@Nate Yeah that’s the plan, he’s going to show me how to do a bunch of stuff.
@DocBrian that doesn’t sound right – McGee would have ridden a BT to his team pursuit gold. That may well have been his road bike from 2004 – But the Lapierre he rode was alloy with a carbon rear stay.
At any rate don’t beat yourself up – if it was ridden by McGee, even if it was Ti , he still would have destroyed it.
Nice work on the Giant Steps ride – a great cause. Hope you got to spend some time with Rob Crowe
I think I have a better fit going on now, slid the saddle back another 5mm, and slammed the stem. Seems like an appreciable amount of more reach, just need to get some more time in. May need to go try out other cockpit setups if what I have done isn’t enough. Do shops let you try bars/stems in the store on your bike, or is it just buy it and hope it works?
I might have a line on a very good price on last year’s fizik R3s in red. My bike stuff is mostly blue if not black/white, but I kind of like the idea of obnoxiously red unmatching GTH kinda shoes. Thoughts? I remember hearing they were fairly narrow, which would be great, anyone with fit experience?
@DerHoggz I’ve got a pair of red R3s, although their not too obnoxious on my white and red bike with red club kit.
I’ve got fairly wide and high feet and they’ve been fine although I haven’t done any huge distances in them yet, 100km max. I do find that the height of my instep causes me to have the middle strap very loose.
When I first got them they were slightly loose in the heel but it’s not something that I notice now that I’ve had them for a while.
Thy’re certainly much better than the budget Shimano pair I had before and look simply fantastic in comparison. I just need some hot weather so I can sit around drinking espresso and looking good in them.
@Mark1 Yes, the Sartos can be a tad “high end.” But if you are getting custom carbon from Italia… Not to mention the pedigree. They are the dirty little secret of pro peloton rides. Prior to launching their own line, they were an OEM for other Italian made bikes; and had a big hand in custom set ups for pros. You wanted a certain ride quality but your sponsor XYZ doesn’t make ’em, Satro would make it and paint it to look like a regular team bike. Ride what the pros truly ride! (Disclaimer/full disclosure – of course, I own a studio & after doing my homework, I will be the Calgary area dealer.)
Help!
While shopping online last night for Enve full carbon forks, I happened across a number of accounts of catastrophic failures of carbon forks. Horrible, grisly stuff: death, paralyzation, disfigurement. Now I’m freaked out and thinking about steel forks.
Has anyone had a carbon fork fail on them or know anyone who has? I’m going to become more conscientious about inspecting my fork before every ride, but the picture that has formed in my mind of flying down the backside of my favorite big training climb and having the front of the bike disintegrate at 65 kph is turning me into a p@&sy.
I’m comfortable with risk, and we’ve all got to go sometime. A blaze of glory is ok by me, but broken, incapacitated and still alive would suck.
There are other things to worry about… Right?
@mcsqueak
FYI, if the site scales your image to fit in the post, it also adds a link to it so you can see the full-screen size. We don’t stop building features until you guys start noticing them!
@mcsqueak, @Nate, @scaler911
Not a fan of compacts myself, but the VMH loves them. This is precisely what they do. Watch the reach from the lever to the bar as well; that can vary based on the bend of the bar.
Also, consider a classic bend; it might take a bit of getting used to in the drops, but you do wind up with lots more options on where to ride, exactly – and once you unlearn your hand from sitting on a flat surface (which it has not natural need to do, btw), you’ll find its actually much nicer to have the curve form to your fingers rather than your palm.
Not sure about classic-bend bars and compact, but I’m sure someone makes them. To Nate’s point, the key measurement there is from the tops to the drops, so focus on that dimension to find a good match.
@Gianni
I also get all bike stuff sent to work under the cover of darkness, that way, when worn or used for the first time and the inevitable question is asked, like, “when did you fucking get that ?” the standard response is, “ive had it for ages, you remember, I told you it was on sale and you said ok! ”
Wonder how many packages from bike companies, including the never to be mentioned Wiggle and Pro Bike Kit for fear of LBS converstaion, actually go to home addresses. Im figuring not too many.
@frank yeah I favor classic bend myself. Looks right, feels right.
@Spun Up don’t get spun up over it. Enve forks are super awesome. Get them. The crap you hear or read on the Internet is why a piece of carbon failed. The real reason that is.
Every mechanic has heard, “I was just riding along…” I call bullshit. Carbon fibet is used in fucking airplanes for fuck sakes
@Spun Up
Carbon gets a bad rap and for good reason, but Alu should get just as bad a rap. The bottom line is that with a manufacturing defect, any part can fail. Alu and Carbon both suffer from stress fractures, and both need to be watched.
The big issue with carbon is that people tend to forget that when it fails, it fails catastrophically. A dear friend of mine had a carbon frame that had a crack in the bottom bracket, and he kept riding the rame, saying he was watching it closely to make sure it didn’t grow, at which point he’d sent it in for warranty repair.
The trouble with that is the frame will show no add’l wear until it breaks completely. Alu is generally the same way, by the way, but it doesn’t break as cleanly or quickly.
I might point out that the only two carbon failures I know of at Roubaix are for Maggy Backstaeds carbon wheels (which were ridden outside the manufacturer’s explicit instructions) and Hincapie’s fork. Hincapie’s fork, ironically, had no issue with the carbon, but with the alu steerer they used for its “additional strength”.
Carbon depends on the integrity of the carbon weaves on the various layers that make up its structure. If they are sound, the gear should hold up. If not, who knows what will happen.
Cut your fork steerer with care – don’t shred the fibers. Maintain your shit, and hope you don’t have a product with a defect. Because if you do – wether its carbon, alu, or steel – a failure in a fork or wheel will suck major balls.
Hincapie’s Alu Steerer Goes Schleck.
@frank
My experience with failing Alu.
My first roadie, an aluminium-framed Avanti with carbon seat stays, had a bit of chainsuck. Then later developed a creak. The creak stayed with me for maybe three weeks, getting worse if I stood on the pedals to climb. At some point I took the cranks off, determined to check the BB and regrease etc. Chainsuck had chewed up the chainstay, so much so that i could see into the tube. As I pedaled, it creaked and widened, so the tear was perhaps half way through the tube.
Not the most instant or catastrophic failure in my case.
@frank what he said!
@mcsqueak With reference to your post about on hood positions, I’m a fan of the “lazy superman” but I find the position that it places my body on is not that much different to the position that I’d be in in the drops other than the angle of my forearms.
Obviously there are a few other variables affecting that but it might be worth considering, in your quest for new bars, that your current bars might well be fine if you’re comfortable with the lower hood level you may still be comfortable in the drops.
@all
While building the new carbon road bike I realized I had not spent much time looking for a set of skewers. I am currently looking at these for the new machine….
http://www.dtswiss.com/Components/RWS/RWS-Road-titan
I would be interested to hear any opinions you guys might have for or against these skewers. Or if you have other recommendations, I’d love to see them. Thanks for the help, guys.
-Dinan
@Dinan I’m not 100% clear on how they work but I understand they’re tightened by rotating the lever and there is a ratchet so that short “throws” can be made. Probably not a problem on the front but if the ratchet is too widely spaced you may find the the throw of the lever is longer than the space between the seat and chain stays to allow proper Rule #41 compliance.
Other than that, I’m not sure what they add that a set of quality traditional skewers doesn’t already offer. I can see the point of the thru axle mtb versions if you’re looking to stiffen things up a little but Tulio got it pretty much spot on with the original.
@Chris
@Chris
Thanks for the reply, Chris. They do have a ratchet-like system (it’s pretty clever) built into them. I’ve seen the steel versions of the skewers on a couple bikes at my LBS. They seemed solidly built and looked decent enough. The link above is to the titanium road version.
However, skewers are just not something I pay much attention to when needing to replace or buy new. Considering, this is my first carbon rig, I wanted to do it right and get decent components. Even down to small details like the skewers. My knowledge on these is very limited, so I am turning to the experts here. And thanks for the reminder about Rule #41. Duly noted.
-Dinan
@Dinan The tech doc suggests you tighten them by turning them one way and loosen them by turning them the other. It’s not clear what provides the security – what happens if they are knocked, do they get loser?
I would have said that a good guide line would be skewers to match your hubs if the hubs are decent and come with skewers if not then match your groupset.
I need a set of decent skewers as well, I’m swapping my dura-ace pair between my nemesis/dura-ace wheels and the cheapo OEM wheels that came with the bike (roller use only). The cheapo skewers seem to have migrated onto one of the kids bikes.
@Dinan It’s not my direct experience, but my mother’s DT Swiss-laced wheels came with these. In a sentence: They’re great. Super-easy to tighten properly (as in, hard). She’s always afraid of clamping the QRs too tight to get them open again which results in loose skewers, so that’s a very good way to ensure this doesn’t happen. Since you open and close by turning, you just keep turning until it clears the lawyer tabs – quicker wheel removal.
If not those, I strongly recommend a proper closed-cam QR. I myself use Ultegra and Dura-Ace ones – they’re not super-light, but they grip the dropouts like crazy.
I have way too many friends with weight-weenie QRs that won’t close properly. One actually lost it descending a corner – wheel wobbled in the dropouts and he lost control in the curve. Luckily he smashed into the cliff and not off it.
@Dinan I had the DT Swiss and it took me a some time to get used to the different system. I broke my rear skewer and ended up replacing them with a skewer similar to the ti lock’s above. I looked at a bunch of options, hands down the Dura Ace are the best (that I saw) in terms of proper closure – you knew they were clamped down and locked in. Some of the other aftermarket skewers will be a little more fidgity in getting a proper clamp but have weight savings on the Dura Ace. The DT system is okay, takes some getting used to, once dialed in they work great. Good luck!
@Tobin so how are the new skewers working out so far? Have you been able to get on the road down there in SE Calgary?
@Dan_R new skewers are great, thanks again! Been mostly on the trainer, my outside rides have been with my 10 year old working on sprints ahead of our upcoming BMX season…for some reason I figured after a 25 year absence it was time to come back and race in the cruiser class. I give the cranks and pedals another week or so before I snap them!
@Chris
Thanks for the reply, Chris. I appreciate it.
The wheels I ordered are from Industry Nine and they do not come with skewers so that’s why I am in the market. I have always just used skewers from Mavic or whatever Specialized has put on the bike OEM. The DT Swiss skewers mentioned above do match the build on my bike save for the red DT Swiss emblem. The bike itself is pretty much blacked out or raw carbon. The red on the skewer would be just about the only color on the bike. While it’s not bad to look at it, it does stand out. Plus I did put a fair amount of love and money into building a pretty stealthy bike. Is it ruined with that little bit of red? Who knows….
-Dinan
@tessar
Thanks for the reply, tessar. I appreciate it.
I have read good stuff about the DT Swiss skewers as well. They are currently my leading contender for the new build. I am glad to hear that you’ve had good personal experience with it. That makes me feel better to know people here like them too.
@all
I also ran across this article on the Google Webz. Nice little article reviewing twelve high end skewers. Thought you folks might find it interesting as well.
http://fairwheelbikes.com/cycling-blog/products/12-high-end-skewers-reviewed.html
-Dinan
@Tobin
Thanks for the reply, Tobin. I appreciate it.
Reading comments from this thread as well as other forums I can’t find anything negative about the DA 9000 skewers other than the slightly increased weight. The DT Swiss Titans are about 45g each and the DA 9000s are about 60-65g each. That being said, I am in no position to say one is better than the other. Thus why I am here trolling for advice.
Assuming cost isn’t an issue, would you go with the DA 9000 skewers with the increased weight? What was it about the DAs that made you feel that they were closed more appropriately? The feel of clamping them down or other factors?
-Dinan
@Dinan I always felt like I was “torquing” my DT’s too much and making them too tight. I have always used traditional quick release skewers so the tightening method of the DT’s just seemed odd. That being said, they were very effective and I never had any problems at all. With the DA I knew just from feel and familiarity of the system that they were engaged and tight. If cost wasn’t an issue I would probably go with the DA only out of personal preference, not because of performance. Regarding the weight difference, I am no help here as I am just under 5 10 and weigh 225lb’s. I need to worry more about shedding lb’s off my own frame rather than 20 gram’s off my bike. I can tell you that the DT’s performed well under the stress of my weight and the only reason they broke was due to a mishap in the garage and not on the road (my 10 year old hammered into the skewer with his bmx). I think if you are not set on any certain format you will be happy with the DT’s and they will work well for you.
Since we’re talking QRs, is it possible to overtighten them? Alloy frame, but it looks like the rear derailleur moves in a bit when clamping.
@DerHoggz
In was wondering about the same thing, but in relation to hub bearing pre-load, a concept I’m not entirely getting my head around.
just when i thought i’d get to take the #1 out, i realize campagnolo doesnt include any cable end caps. damn you!
@roger You are making me paranioid that I am missing something for my upcoming build. I have cable end caps though.
@Dinan Get DA or Campa according to your build kit. In light of failure mode, I don’t trust shaving weight and function on skewers, much like brake calipers. I have traditional QRs, and I have a lightweight set, and my confidence in them varies in inverse proportion to their (minimal) weight.
@Tobin
Hot!
I’ve recently learned there’s a good BMX racing scene here in Seattle.
@DerHoggz
You can if you have Shimano or Campy hubs, because they use loose ball bearings that sit inside a cup and cone arrangement, and if you overtighten the ball bearings will grind and the wheel won’t spin like it should. It’ll also wear out prematurely, and cheap shit wheels will have the same set up but you should throw those away as soon as you can get them off whatever bike they’re on.
With DT, Mavics, and a lot of other types of hub they use bearings that are press fitted into the hub shell and will be much harder to impair their performance by overtightening, because they either tend to come with shit QRs, or the construction of the hub means you won’t necessarily be applying force to the bearings. You can still do it, but you’ll have to tighten it a LOT and have a really strong QR to do it with.
PS you might want to check and make sure the screws holding the derailleur hanger on are tight.
@Tobin nice! Of course I live in the Town where the movie Rad was filmed so approve of your midlife foolishness!