Reverence? Tubs
We can mimic the pros in many ways; kit, bikes, shaving our legs. Even if we’ll never ride like them, we can try (mostly in vain) to look like them. We’ll buy a piece of equipment because our favourite pro endorses it, or even adopt trends that the peloton have, such as alloy classic bend bars, slamming a 140mm stem, or putting those plastic sticky things across the bridge of our noses (yep, I actually did this in the mid 90’s when Tinker Juarez was rocking them on the mtb World Cup circuit. It didnt help a bit, and I looked like a twat). There are many pro traits that are certainly frowned upon and should never be attempted, like wearing the rainbow bands or maillot jaune. Then there are things we would love to be able to do, like snort cocaine with 18 yo models, but there’s as much chance of that as Cav finishing the Vuelta. And finally, there’s things that we can do, but are probably too cautious or conservative to do.
Like running tubs.
We know that every pro bike has the tyres glued to the rims, but how many of us actually own a set of tubs? How many would like to own a set? How many get the fear of Merckx put up them at the mere thought of getting caught miles from home with a flat? Ok, I hear you say, they’re only for racing, but how many of us are good enough to benefit from the reduced chance of a pinch flat on the cobbles, or the decreased rolling resistance from a 100 gram weight saving? I’m not seeing many hands… anyone, anyone? But still, I want some!
I’ve been on a mission to find a light set of wheels for Il Profetta, and scouring eBay and TradeMe has coughed up quite a few sets of tubs. Some going pretty cheap too. Several times I’ve been poised to push the ‘buy now’ button, but like a kid too scared to jump into the river from the highest bridge in town, I keep pulling back from the edge. It’s like, I might hit the water wrong and break my neck, but probably won’t. At worst, my shorts might fall down while scrabbling back up the bank to dry land, with the other kids pointing and laughing. It’s a risk I’m not willing to take. Clinchers are like having extra-strong elastic in the trunks, plus a drawstring for back up. Tubs on a punter’s bike are like a pair of Speedos on a fat bastard.
Just as I was ready to give up the idea of tubs altogether, we received an impassioned email out of the blue from an enthusiastic sew-up fan going by the moniker of “Tubolari”. He suggested in no uncertain terms that it was less than hardcore to ride clinchers or even to use tyre levers to remove them. The most surprising thing was, he wasn’t a grizzled old Italian mechanic or former Belgian domestique, but has only been riding for a year. Is it merely a case of wet-behind-the-ears zeal, or is he onto something? Should we all be digging out under the house and storing a stash of tubulars in there to age them? Let’s see…
Tubolari’s reasons for riding tubulars:
- You get to say you ride tubulars with a smug grin.
- It is an appropriate procedure to simply ask for tubulars in determining whether or not a bike shop is a REAL bike shop even if you don’t plan on buying tubulars.
- Tubulars are generally relegated to the lightly used sections of a store thus making you more hardcore because you need to blow dust off of the packaging just to read the specs that you’ve already read online.
- Personally, I use tape (Velox Jantex 76 Competition tubular tape) and that pretty much takes the hassle out of it. I think though, it makes me less hardcore than those who use glue.
- I love it when a machine breaks (tubbie flats), it shows that a machine is just as vulnerable as a human. I love to bring my machine back to working order like a doctor. It also gives me a reason to don my Campy cap and sing Italian tunes like in Breaking Away.
- Subjective qualities:
- I take a corner at speed with tubs (Gommitalia Challenge $30 a pop) and feel the bump (I begin to panic) but the tubbies have already deflected around the rock and I’m safe, I grin and press on.
- I take a corner at speed with clinchers (Continental Grand Prix 3000, $75 a pop) and feel the the bump (I begin to panic) and jump about what feels like half a foot sideways (I check my shorts, they are dry), I press on.
- I joined a charity ride as a volunteer (ride guide), I am the official tubular tire repair/changer mechanic and get my own car, walky talky and office. The office I use will be for participants to drop off their tires and wheels for spares so I can SAG them on the ride. Not bad for starting road biking last year right?
- Piling spare tubs in your jersey gives others a conversation piece when on tours with your local club.
- Merckx rode tubulars so it seems only fitting ;).
- Tubulars are like wine, you like some, you don’t like others. Some go well with Steel and some go well with Carbon Fiber.
Some compelling points for sure, and it’s hard to argue with his passion. Or is it? Keeper Gianni loves an argument, and can refute the strongest of opinions with a sneer, or just by hitting the reply button;
Yeah, yeah, senor Tubolari, talk to me in a year when you have peeled off, opened up, patched, re-sewn, re-glued, and re-glued more a bunch of tubolaris. Sure you may get laid more often riding tubulars, but trying to get a girl’s bra off with all that tubasti glue on your mitts is tough.
I’ve done my time with them and moved on, tubless road clinchers is where I’m heading, the great beyond. Come with me.
Cheers, Gianni
Think I’m gonna sit on the fence on this one for a while longer, and leave my pro tyre-emulation to these or these for now…
Yes, Jeff in PetroMetro. There was a time that if you used the term “tubular” people wouldn’t know you were refering to a bike tire. They would have though you meant: cool!
My first roll out from the LBS on my soon-to-be-my-first-real-bike-with-sewups was a “Holy S—“, life changing experience.
And then you experience everything that comes with tubular/sewups. Like patching tires in the evening just so you can ride in the morning.
@Jeff in PetroMetro
Exactly how do you do this in your neck of the piney woods, Tex?
I’m still running clinchers on the road, and probably will for the foreseeable future. But I’m really thinking about tubeless for the mtb. Just waiting to see what’s going on sale this fall, and what I’m going to see at Interbike this year (yes, I’m going, and will be submitting an article).
@Gianni
As I predicted, less than 24 hours after a velominatus makes an assertion about tubs, the comments go apeshit with opinions.
Velominati look Pro on the bike, and the Bike looks Pro. Thats what The Rules(tm) require. Now, on closer examination, The Rules(tm) are specifically silent about *exactly who* makes this happen. Yes, there is some knobbage about ones VMH, costs etc etc, but if a Velominatus is going to look Pro, this might really entail having their own wrench, support car and sponsor. That’s Pro. Until then, the choice of equipment is going to entail some…engineering optimization. A balanace, if you will, of the time it takes to get That Fucking Bike out on the road, and the resulting decrease in dollars available to buy More Bike Shit.
I think looking Pro means getting my fat ass out on the Bike as much as possible. If that means resorting to clinchers to make that happen faster…well…
Holy shit…where’s the tylenol?
Doesn’t Rule #5 prohibit the use of gloves when gluing tubies?
I would think that growing up riding & gluing tubulars makes one more likely to ride them today than starting with high-quality clinchers & being a bit wary to switch over to a system that requires a lot more time & skill, with possibly negligible benefits.
@sgt
I don’t anymore. I was referring to when I raced in Austin, New Mexico, and Colorado.
The fastest I’ve ever descended in a race was 101 km/h (63mph). So said my Avocet. I assume it was kind of accurate. I got dropped on a climb and scrambled to get back on and up to the front so I could start the next climb and get dropped again.
I trained on clinchers and raced on sew-ups. Sometimes I trained on sew-ups if they were brand new and needed the new-ness worn off.
I ride exclusively on clinchers now (Conti GP 4000S) as I can’t afford a set of sew-ups, much less a set of wheels to run them. However, I still have my old race wheels for my newly fixed-up Mercian (my last surviving race bike from the 80’s).
@brett
Um.
@frank
Caught that””and guffawed. Not sure that the nose bandaid and inhaling a wasp at the same time is terribly Pro. Isn’t the bandaid designed to help you breathe through your nose?
Oh…the feel of sew-ups. Done right, they are superior by every measure, but done wrong, they are crappier by every measure.
I suppose the first lesson is if you have really sold out on tubulars, go all in. Crappy tubulars have left me out on the road with the only consolation tubulars have, they rarely BLOW, they slow leak, and usually slow enough to get home limping. Good tubulars though have never done this to me, but I also only run them now on race day, no training at all.
And on race day they are faster, they pickup to speed faster, they roll forever and if that isn’t enough I must admit I just love the rights of passage; if you will. Like the rights of passage when I started racing, I shaved my legs and KNEW my commitment was deep, and I was identifiably a cyclist without doubts as I walked up to purchase my duds, with fellow cyclists having shaven legs ready for the wounds of battle to follow. When I went through the 3 day process of gluing my tubulars, 1 coat of glue on the rims, followed by 2 coats on each the tyres and the rims, each one 24hrs apart…when I was done, it was the same feeling, accomplished. I had passed. Now, when I pull them out, sink them into place as I switch out all the training ride gear for race gear….I feel the same.
Now I am running the Clement Criteriums, 175psi. Its like rolling on glass, cornering on rales, it just makes me feel like a rabid monkey all over it when the time comes.
@Steampunk
Der Kaiser and I disagree.
@frank
At the risk of public scorn to the newb here I’m going to call you out for a rules #41 violation. Unless it is just the photo that makes them both (front and rear) look like they are in violation then I’ll just go back to my corner and sit quietly.
New bike isn’t here yet either so…
fasthair
@Jeff in PetroMetro
Oh heck, that explains what the Belgian toothpaste you all go on about is! And explains why Belgians are weird…
I’m impressed this place is actually quite reverent towards tubs and those that have used them aren’t being shouted down by uninformed meatheads who have barely managed to change an inner tube.
When I saw the article, I was like, fuck, here we go again, but it has done rather well.
And then Scaler tried uploading a photo and failed, over and over again, and oh how we laughed! @hungsolo
You know what’s in that shit? I don’t so I’m using gloves.
@Brett “some of them even look pretty cheap”… Yeah, this is what the guy in my LBS told me to try and persuade me to go for a set of Lightweight rims (£2,600 per tubular pair vs £3,600 for clincher versions)… I laughed and told him a) that’s nearly 1.5 new bikes there, and b) you are forgetting to include the £65,000 for the car and driver I’d need as support… He then, to be fair, moved onto trying to sell me the new bike, successfully, I might add… So in hindsight, the behavioural economist in me tells me he ain’t so dumb… Ho hum
Triathletes, Mid life crisis failures and tubular wheels all go together like bacon on chiken. It’s easy taking money off people like that.
I currently feel a little dirty, kind of like a ho, because I’m running clinchers on Colnago C59. Surely I am violating many rules here and offending past cycling greats who are looking down on me in utter disgust. But as soon as powertap starts shipping the new G3 hubs I will have a set of ENVE carbon wheels with sew ups. And then my cycling karma will will be strong.
@minion
I think most on here would agree the tubulars are sweet, but the cost/benefit ratio isn’t there for many of us. Doesn’t mean they are bad tires, though.
And your point on gloves: the first time I didn’t bother to wear gloves while cleaning parts with citrus degreaser and wound up with a burning sensation on my hands and dry skin for three days was the last time I made that mistake. Who knows what’s in that shit, indeed. Reading the MSDS for a chemical can be scary.
@minion
You know how bad that shit pisses me off? Didn’t need you a-holes seeing it anyway.
Hehehehe! And then one time, at band camp…
@minion
Ha!
And how the hell does McSqueak get to orange before me? My spelling is equally as appalling as his…
@minion
Because I’m a true Velomi-pimp (hats off to Ron and G’phant for the inspiration).
Loving this article/commentary (Hehehehe! And then one time, at band camp… ) and now ride clinchers but miss the days of $15 Czech Barums for training and then $50+ Conti silks for racing. 320 grams vs. 250, hard ass ride vs. sitting on a cloud, 120lbs on dry days and 90lbs in the wet – only went down once in the rain and that was going for a $10 prime.
The wheels I was talking about are Wolber Aubisque Super Champions, the set I was comparing to is Alex EST 13/14s.
I haven’t only been riding for one year though…I’ve just come back to roading it up seriously and competing for one year…Finally got back to time trials and such.
Tubolari
@mcsqueak
Quality over quantity is good if you can pull it off. If you can’t, then a high volume, low margin business is your fate. Regrettably, I’m more Giant than Colnago. Sigh …
@G’phant
Giant!?! Giant make great velomi – bikes! You, you’re more like a world rider. Classy for 1976
@Minion
Hah!
@G’phant
Your Velomi-name should be G’iant.
Haha. Band camp. That why I always keep a box of rubbers handy. With 10 of ’em, I can make a pair of gloves.
@fasthair
Good catch, Eagle Eyes!
@ChrisO
i use a computrainer when i coach, i use a trainer when i warm up before some races, I use emotion rollers in the winter when the weather sucks. I ride almost everyday and my weight is only 10lbs over when i was in high school 40 years ago. its a fact, the more you weigh, the quicker you wear out equipment, you can ride 25mm tubbies and get a great ride, much better than clinchers.
@Oli
I don’t see a problem. Clearly this is a mountain time trial.
When you’re inhaling wasps, out of the saddle in the little ring, every aero advantage helps!
Dumb practical question – whenever you puncture a tubular, how do you get home?
@Dr C
Vittoria Pit stop or tufo latex sealant. Or rip it off and put a pre glued one on.
@Dr C
Its faster to change a tub after flatting – under you seat secured by an old toe strap is an old but good folded tire that has old but still tacky glue so the flat is ripped off and the spare plonked on, pumped up and off you go. On long rides you might have a 2nd spare folded in a jersey pocket.
@Dr C
1. Vittoria Pitstop. 2. Spare tub carried in rear pocket or – in rule violation – in saddle bag. Arundel do a tub sized saddle bag. Buy used tub as spare (see ebay) ’cause it’ll be prestretched, just check its not punctured. 3. Train. Option potentially not available in some jurisdictions. 4. Phone wife. Actually, scratch option (d), it would be easier just to buy a house where you suffer puncture.
This is one of downsides of singles. When everyone rode them you could feel relaxed about a flat because there’d be enough spares to get you all home. Now few people ride them one is on one’s own. I think there’s an economics term for this but I’ve forgotten what it is.
@eddysboy
On the weight, I still don’t understand. Yes it may be a fact that the more you weigh the faster you wear stuff out but that presumably applies to any tyres (to the extent that it actually makes a measurable difference).
You said one could train all day on tubs if under 175lbs so I was asking why the weight limit ? If it’s just that being lighter is better then one could train even longer/better if you were 150lbs and 175 is just an arbitrary number. Or is it that you think that for riders over 175lbs tubs are not better ? I’m not disputing it, but you set the figure so I’m asking why.
On the trainer… it was a joke Joyce… that’s what those little things ;-) mean. Lighten up (metaphorically obviously), especially when you’re using a discussion forum to tout for business.
@Dr C
“Hello Huni? I’m way away from home, could you come get me?”
@ChrisO
Tires are a cost of doing business. You can spin the debate out to the ends of the earth and back about the best way to use what when but your tires shouldn’t stop you getting on the road.
@Nof Landrien
Also, using a single toe strap to attach the tub to the seat rails behind the seat post. That space was made for a folded up tub.
Any thoughts on the Cole T24 Lites – which have a 25mm rim width – with a 24mm tub? What’s half a mill either side between friends?
@Minion
Ummm, nope, I’ve read that three times and I haven’t the faintest clue what bit(s) of my post you’re referring to…
Eddysboy said, rather mysteriously I thought, that you could train all day on tubs if you were under 175lbs. I asked him what was behind the weight limit and he replied that heavier riders wear stuff out faster – but that doesn’t explain why its 175lbs not 150lbs or 166lbs and 11ounces.
As a 187lb rider (and 6’3″) I demand to know !
@scaler911
I’ve made that call before. Ha ha ha!
@all
predictably unsound advice, especially about the phone call, thanks
I just assumed they must be massive compared to a spare inner tube, which I stuff down the front of my shorts, but then I guess I could always wrap it around my body like they did in the 30s
I also assumed that when you glued them on, they were meant to stay on, so getting them off would ruin the tyre, and leave a mess on the rim, so you couldn’t stick another one on
That said, they do look the cat’s pyjamas, and I must try them out sometime, if nothing else to feel intellectually superior
@Jeff in PetroMetro
Ha, thankfully I’ve only made one call so far, and it’s because I had gone further away from home than planned, and down a rather large hill (Scaler: Went down Cornelius Pass Rd into Washington Co. by mistake a few weeks ago, instead of OLD Cornelius Pass Rd… whoops, bit of a difference there) so I was clearly not going to make it back home by the time I had originally estimated. I just had to let her know that no, I don’t need a ride, but I’m going to miss our previously scheduled appointment by a bit of a margin…
Unless I injured myself badly or wrecked my bike too bad to ride it, I’d feel a bit silly calling home. Especially for something such as a tire.
@Minion
I have image of fighting with a roll of Cellotape – or does this glue know what to stick to and what not to stick to
Would feel understandably anxious about shoving a pre-glued tyre down my shorts, unless they come in natural skin colour, in which case that might prove positively advantageous
I ride Hutchinson Fusion 2’s on a road tubeless set up. It rolls smoothly and doesn’t flat (knock on wood).
@mcsqueak
would seem a brave move to phone and ask for a ride – bad enough you need her to come and collect you in the first place……you USA lot are so direct
….. but then you USA lot think an arse is called a fanny, which would of course cause all sorts of confusion with a European lady
@harminator, @Oli, @fasthair
Indeed it was a TT. I had also ordered new aero race gloves (which I rode on Haleakala) but they didn’t arrive on time. I was obviously devastated by this and the knowledge that my hands weren’t aero as I communed with butterflies weighed heavily on me. Heavy stuff.
Here’s the bike on level ground (the shot of me climbing is on a steep little 17%-er. Strictly speaking, if the front is in compliance for the TT clause, then he rear is out of compliance.
@fasthair
You aren’t risking public scorn for calling me out on anything. Certainly not from Officer Oli who, among other contributions around these parts, also finds that my spelling and grammar is the only on the site that requires correcting.
@ DrC
Of the flats I have had on tubulars on the road, none of them were the POP, CRACK and blow out like i have had w/clinchers, all of mine have been slow leaks, slow punctures and even 20k out i was able to limp home, plus one CO2 cartridge.
I have carried the spare on long rides when i would be out of touch for a while, and could have popped the tubular off, and even though it is surprising, you can pop a tubular off as quickly and put one on dry to limp home as quickly as a clincher. So, yes, they are glued on for a reason, but they can come off just the same. Makes sense, right? But so do clinchers and the rubber grabby thingy’s that ethereally grab the rim conceptually until you dive into a corner. really, its all the same minutia to some degree, and now we are simply considering it all in fine detail.
I frankly agree and have no clue as to the wt issue someone brought up, i come in at ~165-170 and go through tires/chains/cassettes/etc fast as anyone, so perhaps there is a caveat there or…something
hope that clears things some…for now
@all
I’m in post-vacation dig-out so haven’t had a chance to read the thread yet, so at the risk of dragging the conversation back to the subject of Tubs…
I’m currently riding Mavic Open Pros on my Campa hubs on the TSX. My winter-project ambition is to build these over into tubs. But as Bretto describes here, I am very wishy-washy about whether it’s a good idea. I desperately want them, and also am feeling good about a Spring trip to Vlaanderen to ride the cobbles, where obvs the only option is 3-cross tubs; Zipps are staying home.
But do I dare ride them on Bike #2 during the rest of it’s lifetime? I hardly ever (touch wood) get flats…so what’s the risk? Very little, I suppose.
I’ve also recently made the switch to latex tubes in my Zipps. What a massive fucking difference that makes. The bike rolls so incredibly nicely with those…if that’s even a taste of how tubs ride, there is a lot in it.
All my regular tubes are on the way out for latex lovelies…are my clinchers on the way out as well?