Kermis: To Carbone or Not To Carbone-That is No Longer The Question

This carbon wheel issue has been burning a hole in my soul for so long. The twin headed snake of thrift and indecision (not such an impressive snake as far as twin headed snakes go) held me at the impasse for years. Having @mauibike commit to all carbon for his lifetime wheelset needs got me hot. Seeing Fabs winning Paris-Roubaix and the Ronde on his Aeolius 5.0 wheels made the fever burn higher.

Maui is a very gusty place to ride and I was loath to own some deep section rims that would be the death of me. Looking pro while getting blown off the road at speed, uncool. Bontrager has the budget to blow on high speed computing and wind tunnels to make sure Gianni is not buffeted unduly. They also use Alpina spokes with plastic inserts so the the wheel should be truable for years.

Ebay is full of people who buy tubular wheels then sell them after very light use (or their first flat tire). Voila, Gianni finally owns Fabooo’s tubular wheels.

The first impression on the first ride was holy smokes, these float uphill. The weight difference was what impressed me immediately. I take off the front wheel when transporting the bike and I still marvel at its lightness. This lightness is also noticeable when cornering and not in a good way. The flywheel effect of a heavier aluminum rim is diminished making the steering, for lack of a better term, whippy. I’m used to it now but for the first few weeks the front end felt less stable.

My wife was quite vexed that I was undroppable on climbs; these wheels were feeling better and better. The improved climbing alone was enough to make me embrace the benefit of carbon construction.

It was during the first descent of Haleakala volcano where the other lightbulb switched on in my dim brain. Unintentionally I was going into every corner faster than usual. My V-meter does not give me data to substantiate the feeling but these wheels are more impressive going down than they are going up. They are fast. When you get off the brakes on a descent the bike just hauls more ass. To add to their list of wonders, they are very stable in gusty crosswinds too. The windtunnel testing was money well spent. Score one for the boffins.

I have not done enough riding in wet weather to have an opinion on rainy day braking. This is my number one bike after all and I’ve avoided the real steep descents if I have a choice.

To address the original question in the original article; can carbon wheels be one’s everyday, go-to wheels? I now say absolutely. These aero wheels are faster in all directions, why would you deny yourself that pleasure everyday. They do cost a huge amount to money new. That is their one massive downside. They can be had reasonably if one looks at slightly used tubulars, what is not to love about that? If one buys the premise that wheels are the most important upgrade to a bike, then buying light, aero, carbon wheels is the way to go.

[kermis id=21811/]

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94 Replies to “Kermis: To Carbone or Not To Carbone-That is No Longer The Question”

  1. 100% of the time, all conditions. I have 303’s for the race bike and William’s for the rain bike (they stop really well even when wet) and cheapo Neuvations on my cross rig. Plus they make the bikes look nice and angry.

  2. Anyone have thoughts on carbon rim braking durability and overheating resistance?  Report after the first Grand Fondo Hincapie was that 9 carbon wheels were ruined on the White Oak Mountain descent.  I lost the wear dimples on a set of Easton EA90s after only 25,000 K.  Fair amount of climbing/descending around here, but the same can be said of many areas.  Maybe current carbon technology has solved the problem.

    BTW, anyone out there doing the Hincapie ride this year?  I’ll be helping at the first rest stop.  Good event but I don’t pay to ride in my back yard.

  3. @Dave

    Anyone have thoughts on carbon rim braking durability and overheating resistance? Report after the first Grand Fondo Hincapie was that 9 carbon wheels were ruined on the White Oak Mountain descent. I lost the wear dimples on a set of Easton EA90s after only 25,000 K. Fair amount of climbing/descending around here, but the same can be said of many areas. Maybe current carbon technology has solved the problem.

    +1
    I’m on the edge for these very reasons. It’s all climbing and descending and crosswinds here. Pros are winning grand tours on them, but they get them replaced a tad cheaper. Not willing to sacrifice much there, until maybe I see just how well they climb.

  4. Funny, I’ve been going through this exact thought process since my Enve rear wheel came out of the Caledonian Cogal looking like it had been attacked by a carbon grater.

    Whether it was the wheel, tube or tyre which failed first is impossible to know, but the upshot was that the wheel was rideable but fucked. When I put my usual Vittorias on they just blew off so for once I was grateful for the extra-tight qualities of Contis.

    Luckily Enve have a good crash-replacement policy so a new wheel was sent to Dubai and is being built up as we speak.

    However I did reflect on the fact that if I hadn’t had something which qualified as crash replacement the wheels, rear in particular, were looking pretty ratty after a year of use in training and racing – about 12,000km. The laminate on the braking surface was patchy and they seemed to come out of true more easily.

    While Dubai roads are generaly excellent the heat and sand seems to have taken a toll and I think I would have wanted to replace it in the next six months anyway.

    But as a powertap user I am a bit dependent on having a wheel with the power meter hub so I have bitten the bullet and ordered a new training wheel. A HED Ardennes is also on its way to me and I will use that as a training wheel and keep the ENVEs for racing and competitive rides. They are lovely wheels and have all the properties described by Brett and Gianni, and ENVE promote them as all-purpose.

    So my summary – it’s true they are OK for everyday use but be prepared for a shorter lifespan, and after a year I’ve decided it isn’t worth it.

  5. I got a pair of Shamal tubs this summer.  They are aero, fast, light, tough and alloy.  I don’t need no stinking carbon.  But I have to admit, I am still tempted.

  6. Simply can’t afford them… got a new set of Campag Ventos this year, that’s where my budget lies. Not as pretty as the Ventos in the gallery there though, current ones are black with some fairly gaudy red and white decals, not those sleek unpainted beauties

  7. The Group-San C24s (I know they’re clinchers but they are a carbon rim) that came with my R3 this year were such a ludicrous jump up from my previous Mavic Aksiums that it was hard to actually work out how much of an improvement the bike itself was….

  8. Don’t we all just love obsessing about all the details?  And wheels ? That’s near the top of the list. If I spent as much time thinking about world peace as I do wheels I’d probably have a nobel prize. In the grand scheme of things that might sound kinda pathetic but whatev… I’m sticking with HED’s Plus wheels, the Ardennes and Jets. There are days that I get the wheel, tire and pressure just right and it’s glorious. I am so, so tempted to have a go with a tubular carbon sub 1400g Stinger wheel set but at end of day I’ve just not pulled the trigger on writing that check.

    In the meantime I tried yesterday to quickly get some 30mm Challenge Strada Bianca open tubulars mounted on my Ardennes +’s and did not have luck. I change tires on my wheels all the time depending on the ride/race ahead and think nothing of it. A couple of minutes and wha-la, ready to ride. But these tires are literally a challenge. Cheers all, RC

  9. I’m still rolling my Golden Tickets, and probably will be for the next few seasons.  I do a lot of gravel riding, and they’re ideal for putting up with shit road surfaces.   I can ride the hell out of them and not stress about it if I trash them – I can deal with laying down $125 for a fresh rim if needs be.  Besides, I’m on Velominatus Budgetatus rules right now, and dropping four figures on some nice carbon hoops isn’t in the plan – a new cross bike is getting priority.

    My guess is that carbon hoops will become ubiquitous for non-pros with the full adoption of road disc brakes – it’s fine for the congnoscenti to deal with crappy braking in the rain, but none of us want dear old dad descending on fading brakes.  Given advances in materials science, it’s totally possible to make cheap, safe, and light carbon clinchers if you don’t have to worry about a rim brake surface.

  10. @wilburrox

    In the meantime I tried yesterday to quickly get some 30mm Challenge Strada Bianca open tubulars mounted on my Ardennes +’s and did not have luck. I change tires on my wheels all the time depending on the ride/race ahead and think nothing of it. A couple of minutes and wha-la, ready to ride. But these tires are literally a challenge. Cheers all, RC

    I hate it when that happens – I’ve had the same struggle with Contis on Golden Tickets:  no bueno.  One day, I’m going to build a database of all the known-good+known bad tubular tire to rim combinations.  It’ll be my great contribution to human civilization.

  11. @Mikael Liddy after spending more than a year thinking about my daughter’s n+1, making the jump up from a 24″ wheel set to 700c, the C24 is exactly the wheel set she’s now riding. She took home a gold medal in AL State RR Champion Jr’s event the first weekend on the new bike w/this wheel set. The circuit featured a steep little climb where she attacked an older young man and left him in her dust. She cracks me up. Considers herself a “climber”. And this wheel set, a carbon alloy hybrid, is exactly perfect for her and her bike. With the AL brake track I have no worries on her learning how to descend and use the brakes properly in different conditions.

  12. I had buried this question and rationalised the R45 / Pacenti SL23 combo on my #1 as being adequate for my needs. Chris King has since announced a run of bright green parts, which would match the decals on my frame perfectly. I’ve managed to hold out so far, but really it’s only a matter of time before I order a pair of R45s in 20/24 drilling that would match a pair of Enves. And once the hubs are here, it’s all over.

  13. One day, maybe.

    Right now I’m content with my Ksyrium SL’s and ES’s.

    Then again, have a new job starting in two weeks and I’ll be commuting 40 minutes each way. Has me thinking about an extra-special commuter, as I already have just a solid commuter. Hmm…rack, disc brakes, fenders…

  14. I got my 303 Fircrest tubular wheelset in July 2013. They have a one year warranty and I did everything I could to do to break them within warranty Period. No such luck. I rode them every ride, up or down, all around, rain or shine, 60kph crosswinds, it made no difference. They are still perfectly round and I have made about 9 half turn on the nipples, to date. I solved any potential wet braking issues by installing an Enve disc fork and a front 303 disc wheel on my Madone. I probably broke some rules, but not my femur. Gianni, I wish you could of delayed this article until I dumped all my aluminum rims and wheels on Ebay.

  15. My go-to training wheels are HED Ardennes SL. Sub 1500g, nice riding and stiff enough. My #1 set for racing and “tuesday night world champs” rides are a pair of Rail 52 carbon clinchers with White Industry T11 hubs. I also rotate in HED jet 6’s and some 50mm Boyd carbon clinchers. If rain is predicted on race day, I go with the Jet 6’s, with their alloy brake track. It’s funny, the Jets are monsterously heavy at almost 1900g, but on flat fast races they seem to be the fastest.

    Unfortunately, in a racing application when you need that extra 1%, the deep rims are required if the guys you are racing against have them. I would never even consider them if I road alone or not competitively. For that matter, if I were the head of the USAC, I would ban carbon wheels as it would make racing less expensive, safer (have seen carb failures in races), and not give advantage to those who try to outspend the competition.

  16. @ChrissyOne

    @Dave

    Anyone have thoughts on carbon rim braking durability and overheating resistance? Report after the first Grand Fondo Hincapie was that 9 carbon wheels were ruined on the White Oak Mountain descent. I lost the wear dimples on a set of Easton EA90s after only 25,000 K. Fair amount of climbing/descending around here, but the same can be said of many areas. Maybe current carbon technology has solved the problem.

    +1
    I’m on the edge for these very reasons. It’s all climbing and descending and crosswinds here. Pros are winning grand tours on them, but they get them replaced a tad cheaper. Not willing to sacrifice much there, until maybe I see just how well they climb.

    I’m paranoid about heating the hell out of my carbon rims on those steep descents where you have to be on the brakes alot. I believe the rims can take it fine, it’s the glue I’m worried about. Durability-wise, I’ll have more data this winter. Bontrager uses cork pads, we will see if they hold the grit in the rain. That’s what has messed up my aluminum brake surfaces. I’ll be very impressed if they hold up well and very depressed if I’ve scored the hell out of them after one rainy, gritty, descent filled Sunday ride.

    These wheels are great climbing, descending and crosswinds. Does Moto GP gone to carbon rims? That is the question.

  17. @Nate

    I got a pair of Shamal tubs this summer. They are aero, fast, light, tough and alloy. I don’t need no stinking carbon. But I have to admit, I am still tempted.

    Trust me laddy, it’s worth saving up for. Mine are replacing some Eurus tubeless. I can’t say the carbon rims corner better but outshine the Eurus in up, down and flat. My first secteur at Roubaix was so incredibly rough I was sure my aluminum campy clinchers (older Scirocco) would not make it to the end of that section. When I saw Boonen and Fabs winning on deep carbon rims at PR, I knew those wheels were as tough or tougher than aluminum.

  18. @Geraint

    I had buried this question and rationalised the R45 / Pacenti SL23 combo on my #1 as being adequate for my needs. Chris King has since announced a run of bright green parts, which would match the decals on my frame perfectly. I’ve managed to hold out so far, but really it’s only a matter of time before I order a pair of R45s in 20/24 drilling that would match a pair of Enves. And once the hubs are here, it’s all over.

    Yeah, life is too short not to have the perfect Chris King hubs and Enve rims. The mango hubs and Enve rims made my temperature spike. These Bontrager DT Swiss hubs are OK but they are not R45s. The crazy thing is, the freehub body comes off with no tools! It just pulls off.

  19. @mauibike

    Gianni, I wish you could of delayed this article until I dumped all my aluminum rims and wheels on Ebay.

    I feel like a hoarder now. Four sets of Campy and Fulcrum clincher wheels hanging in the new bat cave. I hope there is some resale value. Oh, and by the way, nobody actually heeds my advice here, so we are safe for the price of aluminum not crashing anytime soon.

  20. @Gianni

    @mauibike

    Gianni, I wish you could of delayed this article until I dumped all my aluminum rims and wheels on Ebay.

    I feel like a hoarder now. Four sets of Campy and Fulcrum clincher wheels hanging in the new bat cave. I hope there is some resale value. Oh, and by the way, nobody actually heeds my advice here, so we are safe for the price of aluminum not crashing anytime soon.

    Send them to me…

  21. I suppose I’ll go carbon wheel set when I’m also going road disc… that’s a ways a way for me but can we safely assume someone’s gonna some day soon bomb down a rainy, wet Pyrenees Mtn stage to take yellow using disc’s and that’ll be that for timing of a complete peloton conversion? That’s exactly the conversation my buddy and I were having today on our ride.

    My mtn bike has carbon wheels and disc brakes. And they work very, very well.

  22. @wilburrox

    I suppose I’ll go carbon wheel set when I’m also going road disc… that’s a ways a way for me but can we safely assume someone’s gonna some day soon bomb down a rainy, wet Pyrenees Mtn stage to take yellow using disc’s and that’ll be that for timing of a complete peloton conversion? That’s exactly the conversation my buddy and I were having today on our ride.

    My mtn bike has carbon wheels and disc brakes. And they work very, very well.

    Yes, that is the perfect combo. I was not ready to scrap my present bike to go disc and carbon wheel. I’m glad I didn’t wait but yes, if and when a new #1 comes down, it will have to have some carbon aero disc wheels.

  23. @Gianni

    @Geraint

    I had buried this question and rationalised the R45 / Pacenti SL23 combo on my #1 as being adequate for my needs. Chris King has since announced a run of bright green parts, which would match the decals on my frame perfectly. I’ve managed to hold out so far, but really it’s only a matter of time before I order a pair of R45s in 20/24 drilling that would match a pair of Enves. And once the hubs are here, it’s all over.

    Yeah, life is too short not to have the perfect Chris King hubs and Enve rims. The mango hubs and Enve rims made my temperature spike. These Bontrager DT Swiss hubs are OK but they are not R45s. The crazy thing is, the freehub body comes off with no tools! It just pulls off.

    I love mango, as yet unrequited, but there’s time. The sour apple is what’s tempted me to go low spoke count and carbone.

    The [off-topic] question that remains is: should I go all-in and switch to tubulars? I really like your thinking regarding picking up some lightly used ones on ebay, as the savings will pay for a lot of nice tyres, and maybe a few taxis home (or treats for the vmh for rescues) if I get t+1 punctures.

    Your article might have dragged me not one step along The Path, but two. I thank you, sensei.

  24. @Gianni

    I’m paranoid about heating the hell out of my carbon rims on those steep descents where you have to be on the brakes alot. I believe the rims can take it fine, it’s the glue I’m worried about. Durability-wise, I’ll have more data this winter. Bontrager uses cork pads, we will see if they hold the grit in the rain. That’s what has messed up my aluminum brake surfaces. I’ll be very impressed if they hold up well and very depressed if I’ve scored the hell out of them after one rainy, gritty, descent filled Sunday ride.

    These wheels are great climbing, descending and crosswinds. Does Moto GP gone to carbon rims? That is the question.

    Neither MotoGP nor World Superbike use carbon wheels. Not for performance reasons, but for safety and durability. From what I understand, magnesium can be repaired more easily, and carbon MC wheels can be damaged but appear fine. As the stakes are higher at 210 miles per hour, I can understand the reasoning.

    All of this is pushing my buttons. Rain/dirt wear. Descents. Cross winds. Braking. This makes me think carbon would be dry-only wheels for me. I’ve been looking at what’s on ebay and it’s really tempting tho.
    Once I have a rain/CX bike with discs, it will be moot and I can put a set on #1. Until then I don’t think I’d run them in the rain.

  25. Congrats gianni! i think anyone that has ridden a carbon set on a complimentary frame should find themselves in love

    heck of the north and as much as i love my r45/hed plus build, the enves shine and were the perfect wheelset today

    Mo carbone!!!!!

  26. @roger

    Congrats gianni! i think anyone that has ridden a carbon set on a complimentary frame should find themselves in love

    heck of the north and as much as i love my r45/hed plus build, the enves shine and were the perfect wheelset today

    Mo Carbone!!!!!

    Well done Roger. The bike looks like it had fun.

  27. I only race with my dancing shoes on. Train with traditional aluminum 3 cross wheels. The switch is so great from heavy wheels to super fast light tubular carbon wheels. Its the mental and physical advantage I like to give myself. Although more carbon is always good.

  28. The [off-topic] question that remains is: should I go all-in and switch to tubulars? I really like your thinking regarding picking up some lightly used ones on ebay, as the savings will pay for a lot of nice tyres, and maybe a few taxis home (or treats for the VMH for rescues) if I get t+1 punctures.

    Yes, you should.  You won’t regret it.

    The key is to eschew ultralight racing/TT tubs unless you’re 1) racing and 2) have neutral wheel support and 3) have a legion of domestiques ready to fall on their swords and hand you a wheel/bike if you puncture.

    Don’t let the mess and frustration of the first couple of glue jobs dishearten you.  Stick with it.  Once you’ve got the technique down, it’s every bit as easy as mounting a clincher.

    Get yourself some Vittoria Pave Evo CGs and let it rip.  No clincher on earth will ever match them.

  29. I think carbon wheels look bad ass!  Somewhere in that 48 – 52 mm range, black wheels on a black frame, just looks dam awesome!

  30. @ChrissyOne   Of course they would use magnesium, something more exotic than carbon fiber.

    I was just out and got caught in a quality heavy rain. The braking was not impressive, semi-functional but a lot more hand strength to get an effect.  Maybe the pros just never use their brakes. What would Cancellara do?

  31. @tony

    I only race with my dancing shoes on. Train with traditional aluminum 3 cross wheels. The switch is so great from heavy wheels to super fast light tubular carbon wheels. Its the mental and physical advantage I like to give myself. Although more carbon is always good.

    That is a very wise idea. Train heavy then race light and fast.

    I don’t race so I’m just going right to the light and fast(er).

  32. @antihero

    The [off-topic] question that remains is: should I go all-in and switch to tubulars?

    Yes, you should. You won’t regret it.

    Get yourself some Vittoria Pave Evo CGs and let it rip. No clincher on earth will ever match them.

    Absolutely.  The ride of the Vittoria Paves is great, as is their durability.  And I only have one set of clinchers in the quiver — and they don’t get ridden much at all.

    Like @Gianni, I scored some Faboo-esque used tubulars (the net-to-me costs was so amazing I’m not even going to post it) which are pretty much my do everything wheels.

    I had them off for a while since I put on my Nucleons when we had a week of wet weather and was too lazy to swap brake pads back to carbon compatible.  Have to do some service on the Nucleon freehub so put the Bontragers back on for this morning’s ride and remembered now much I like them.

    Would probably have gone with the 50mm profile, but the 35mm deal was so good I couldn’t pass it up.

    I think next go-round tires will be Veloflex Roubaixs or Vittoria Corsa SCs for the tan sidewall look.

  33. @Gianni

    @roger

    Congrats gianni! i think anyone that has ridden a carbon set on a complimentary frame should find themselves in love

    heck of the north and as much as i love my r45/hed plus build, the enves shine and were the perfect wheelset today

    Mo Carbone!!!!!

    Well done Roger. The bike looks like it had fun.

    I wish I had more time to perv over this bike the last 2 days.

  34. @teleguy57

    I approve of your bike choices there: frame, saddle, front fork, white hoods on Campa 11 speed. The whole package being ridden in sunny Colorado, nice day out.

  35. @Gianni

    @teleguy57

    I approve of your bike choices there: frame, saddle, front fork, white hoods on Campa 11 speed. The whole package being ridden in sunny Colorado, nice day out.

    Thanks!  Pic is from the Fraser Valley back in July.  Today’s ride back home in WI was at 37F, windy, and mostly overcast.  But the Aeolus rode as sweetly as ever.

    If I remember right @frank dinged me on the SMP, but mentioned you also were a fan.  As I responded then, it works for me and is usually hidden under my fat butt anyhow.

  36. @Geraint try tubulars. By all means. Get nice tires. The vittorias paves or even better, Veloflex roubaix/arenbergs. Fantastic ride and durable too.  You wont look back.

    @teleguy57 you may find the SCs a bit delicate for Wisconsin applications. And I hope you can get your freehub sorted [emoticon omitted].

  37. WEll, I’m convinced.

    I have a set of Bora tubs which have been off my bike since I flatted and had to be rescued a year or so ago.  They are sitting quietly in bags, waiting for me to spring for a new tyre.  I need to work out a removable-core extender system, so I can run some sealant.

    Currently, my everyday wheels are Shamal Ultra 2 way fit, with a tubeless on the front and a tube on the back, so not exactly shabby.

    Anyone want to offer advice about a nicely durable, but sufficiently light rear tyre option for the Bora ? The front still has a good Tangente which will stay on until it’s destroyed.  Funny, I’ve never had a front flat, only rears.

  38. @Nate

    Nice try, but I went shopping on Wiggle after that last post and now have a Vittoria Pave and some valve extenders on the way.  I’m returning to the dark side of carbon.

    It’s not just cycling.  When I bought my new ocean ski recently, I had a choice between a very nice boat on fibreglass for a fistful of dollars, or a truly pornographic masterpiece in full carbon, for just a few dollars more.

    Despite being a paddling noob, I contemplated the similarity between the carbon jobbie and my lovely Bianchi, which also sports a lot of visible carbon weave, and similarly fast red paint.  Needless to say, I opted for the carbon, and love the decision.  I know I would have regretted cheaping out.  11kg of carbon art.

    Buy well, buy once !!

  39. Reflecting on the importance of carbon, I feel this article missed the chance to wax lyrical on this subject.  I’m getting musings about how carbon is the quintessential element from which the V is born and derives it’s power.

    I’m sure the V has a tetrahedral centre.

    There may even be cause for a new rule.  No cycling rig is complete without at least one carbon part, and no true Velominatus shall sally forth without an article of carbon upon his or her person.  Yes, diamonds count for the ladies.

    Steel may be real ( or at least rhyme with it), but carbon rules.

  40. @RedRanger

    @Gianni

    @roger

    Congrats gianni! i think anyone that has ridden a carbon set on a complimentary frame should find themselves in love

    heck of the north and as much as i love my r45/hed plus build, the enves shine and were the perfect wheelset today

    Mo Carbone!!!!!

     

     

    Well done Roger. The bike looks like it had fun.

    I wish I had more time to perv over this bike the last 2 days.

    You do know that there is TRULY espresso bean grounds in that paint job, right?  Seriously.  That bike is AMAZING!

  41. I ride a pair of 404 tubulars almost every day (not really, I got a kid now, but anyway). I figured, the pros can go blabbering on about “race wheels” and what-not. If I would use these wheels only for races I would use them twice a year. That’s just being irresponsible. If you have a nice pair of wheels, USE THEM! It will improve your life dramatically and is the only way to really justify the cost.

  42. @Nate

    @teleguy57 you may find the SCs a bit delicate for Wisconsin applications. And I hope you can get your freehub sorted [emoticon omitted].

    Yes. I’m still wrestling with that.  Would prefer Veloflex Roubaix, but the cost difference is something warranting consideration.  And yeah, the freehub… dang!  We’ll see what the shop can do as I don’t have the time to get into messing with it.

    @Henrik

    I ride a pair of 404 tubulars almost every day (not really, I got a kid now, but anyway). I figured, the pros can go blabbering on about “race wheels” and what-not. If I would use these wheels only for races I would use them twice a year. That’s just being irresponsible. If you have a nice pair of wheels, USE THEM! It will improve your life dramatically and is the only way to really justify the cost

    You put my thoughts into words exactly!  What good are they hanging in wheel bags???

  43. Late to the thread here, but is there any consensus on an ideal depth of rim? I see everything from 25 to 50+ depths. There might be a pair of carbon rims in my future and I was wondering what might be best?

  44. C2 broken Type 3 odontoid fracture 2009, braking issue.  Never use Swiss Stop Yellow and switch with aluminum wheel sets no matter what the bike shop guy says.  Bontrager provides cork pads use them it says so in the users guide.

  45. @antihero @Nate thanks for the encouragement and advice, chaps. I was thinking Veloflex, although I’m a serial user of Vittoria clinchers (pave CG, Corsa SR & CX) so I’m sure they would do the job nicely.

    It’s interesting how one can read the same thread in two different states of mind and rationalise different sides of the debate. I’ve been firmly in the ‘nice clinchers are fine’ state of mind until recently, but if going carbon I think I’d prefer tubular rims for the inherently stronger design, and that’s tipped me into the ‘what is there to worry about, and life’s too short to compromise’ mindset.

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